Backbone in shaving brushes....thoughts?

Nick the Knife

Krill Enabler
Grand Society
Joined
Sep 4, 2012
Location
Coffs Harbour, NSW
There are a lot of terms thrown around in wetshaving and backbone is one of them.

I understand that it essentially refers to the feedback, flex etc in the bristles of a brush - however my real query is how important do people feel this is in a shaving brush?

What tangible function/benefit does a brush with a lot of backbone (e.g Omega Pro line) provide to the lathering experience as opposed to one that does not have much backbone at all? e.g Plisson syth

I write this as I am genuinely curious about the frequent references to backbone when users critique shaving brushes.

Looking to get a discussion going NOT a this is wrong and that is right as clearly it's a preference thing. :)

Thanks in advance, Nick
 
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Backbone is great for loading hard soaps and for a good face scrub. I used to think I liked a lot of backbone but since I've switched to palm lathering and painting on, I can honestly say my shaves have never been better. And I still manage to easily lather MWF.
 
Backbone is great for loading hard soaps and for a good face scrub. I used to think I liked a lot of backbone but since I've switched to palm lathering and painting on, I can honestly say my shaves have never been better. And I still manage to easily lather MWF.
Now I agree this is the exact same perception I always had - and let me be please emphasise that I am not saying you're wrong - in fact probably the contrary as you've hit on what IMHO are the two most common user perceptions about backbone.

That being:
- that it's a big advantage when loading hard soaps
- it helps scrub one's face

Now just a couple of random thoughts on those 2 very common perceptions.

- It's not something that'd be measurable but I'd wager with absolute certainty that enthusiast shaving soaps are by FAR much softer nowadays than previously. Nearly every single artisan shaving soap maker (and lets face it these are by far the most popular producers at present) uses the Hot Process method to make their soaps, which results in a soft soap - often so much so they're referred to as croaps. Genuinely hard soaps e.g MWF, ToBs refill pucks etc are very much in the minority.

- I agree it's irrefutably true that you can load a given amount of soap onto a stiffer brush than one without backbone. HOWEVER, certain brushes without much backbone e.g synthetics, are acknowledged to need LESS soap to give a 'lather' than natural fibres. So it's an interesting thought that EVEN with a hard soap where you need to load X amount of soap to make a lather to your standards, the softer brush thats more efficient might only need to load 0.6X to accomplish the same.

And if harder soaps are easier to load with stiffer brushes is the inverse also true? That being that softer soaps (of which I would put it to users that there are definitely more) are harder, trickier to load than with a softer brush?

I'm unsure on this one - again I feel it's kinda a line ball thing but I know I've been caught out by a hard brush and loaded way too much or gouged into the croap as it was just very stiff and loaded up too much soap.

- Now the facial thing is very interesting to me. If users didn't use a brush with a lot of backbone would they instead use something else to give them a facial/cleaning type effect? e.g loofah, scrub cream etc. I would imagine the response would be no - they don't see it as being that important it's just a nice little added benefit.

That said I've a funny feeling that the actual facial cleansing effect ACTUALLY performed by the entire shaving process with a stiff brush vs that with a less backboned brush (and in measurable terms I guess you're looking at removing skin cells etc) - but I don't think you'd be looking at a significant difference - if at all. I do think that a brush thats scritchier would give the user the perception that they've removed a lot of skin cells etc as your skin would feel a tad irritated from it but it'd be interesting to know if that actually is the case.

And if exfoliating is a handy added benefit (and I agree it is) it's hard to imagine that a bristle is going to remove a skin cell that WOULDN'T have come off when a razor blade is subsequently run over it multiple times. :)
 
I used to think it was important, til i found out the negative side of it with Chubby's. And now, that with the new synthetic fibres, you don't even much backbone to load soap.

If you want backbone to achieve some scrub with softness, that's another thing. With a good lather I don't feel it necessary, and hot water does all the softening I need. However, the Muhle/Jagger/Aesop brush does have some real firmness to it
 
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Brushes without backbone using standard natural hair haven't been packed to the right density. It's like using a tennis racket with sloppy strings or any other implement that's past it's use by date or is worn. I find floppy brushes annoying to use because you lose accuracy where you're going to spread/place lather. A little dab on the upper lip and you're blowing lather out from halfway up your nose. There might be another mechanism in play with synthetic brushes but standard hair floppy brushes don't work as efficiently compared to appropriately packed ones. Aside from that they just look bad all splayed out with that characteristic chasm in the centre.
 
@Pjotr , ok so accuracy/controlability - thats an interesting one I'd not really considered much but I can see that the superior tactile feedback you're able to get from a properly packed brush (and I think you make an excellent point that the top level brush makers will vary the density/size of the knot depending on the rigidity of the fibres they're using) does assist in making it a more precise tool for lather control once you've already made it.
 
... the softer brush thats more efficient might only need to load 0.6X to accomplish the same.
Requests citation of figures.

Upon a serious note, I find backbone prevents, or at least somewhat minimises the amount of splaying that occurs once the hairs are wet, so a bit is required to prevent a mop.
 
Latest reknot without backbone

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That's a very big topic, that needs a lot of thought...

For now: IMO you can achieve backbone just with the type of hair (boar, 2-band), density (chubby, epsilon), loft and shape of the knot (pointy bulb) - and of course a mixture of the above.

I know I don't like pointy bulb.

I also know, that backbone has nothing to do, if you can lather hard soaps or not. It's just different techniques...
 
Upon a serious note, I find backbone prevents, or at least somewhat minimises the amount of splaying that occurs once the hairs are wet, so a bit is required to prevent a mop.
I'd agree this is something 'backbone' would do - however it's got to be a very soft or poorly engineered brush that would have the type and density of fibres that would allow such extreme splaying to happen. You'd like to think that even the cheapest Chinese generic would test them out a tad to avoid this.

Seems to me in a very generalised summation of lathering there's several stages to it involving the brush (assuming face lathering in this case as thats what i do 99% of the time).
1. Loading - putting soap onto the brush to convey to the face
2. Building lather - you might add water to the brush but you've got a lot of swirling etc, ideally the lather is building on your face but also inside the brush's knot
3. Spreading - you've got the desired lather consistancy, now rather than swirling you tend to 'paint' the lather around your face into the desired areas to the desired depth/thickness
4. Holding of lather + reapplication - generally subsequent passes might be able to be merely painted on using existing lather, other times you might have to 'rebuild/restore' the lather with a bit more of #2 type swirling - but the lather will build again a lot more rapidly than it did initially.

So if I look at where in those steps 'backbone' irrefutably assists to either building a better lather or the same quality of lather more quickly I am really unsure. In #1 I think natural fibred brushes with backbone do have an advantage over other naturals in loading quickly - I think synths negate this as they need less product to get the same ~result.

In #2 I think this is much of a muchness. Best practice user technique is different for a heavily backboned brush vs something much softer, so you'll find preferences either way. I do think a stiffer brush that provides more of a 'scrub' possibly gives a marginally more exfoliating effect than a softer one, I suspect the difference is far less than you'd expect from the brush firmness as the razor used after in both of them is the real remover of dead skin cells.

#3 I think lesser backboned brushes have big advantage in spreading and subsequent passes. Don't get me wrong I'm not talking about complete absence of backbone as @Pjotr alluded - but the ability to have them splay/bend to spread the existing lather within them is much easier than say with a very stiff Omega 48.

#4 again I hope I'm not being biased but in theory and practice I'd feel less backbone brushes have the advantage here. I don't know about others but the really BEST lather is always that last big left right in the heart of the brush, that you often have to squeeze out. Lesser backboned brushes often seem to have more of this type of lather to give and release it much more easily. Once they've got a lather going too they are able to renew it a lot quicker than others.

You do also seem to find that in all the fibre types the ones that on a hair for hair basis have less backbone tend to be the higher priced/more desired fibres e.g silvertip badger>pure badger, horse tail>horse mane, Purtech type synth>nylon/syntex

Please don't get me wrong I'm not for a second saying there's anything wrong with people loving brushes with loads of backbone and all of us clearly enjoy having some degree of backbone in a brush. However, I do personally suspect it's one of those phrases thats bit misused to convey sentiments that aren't accurately depicted by the reference to backbone.

That's a very big topic, that needs a lot of thought...

For now: IMO you can achieve backbone just with the type of hair (boar, 2-band), density (chubby, epsilon), loft and shape of the knot (pointy bulb) - and of course a mixture of the above.

I also know, that backbone has nothing to do, if you can lather hard soaps or not. It's just different techniques...
I agree that QUALITY brushmakers will weigh the hair type/s, density, knot size, loft, and shape (which I think is a great and often overlooked one!) etc all up to make a great brush but I suspect the vast majority of the time they're made to a price point and significant compromise is made.

Agree 100% with your last point - IMHO thats one of the classic misconceptions about hard soaps & the brushes needed for them.
 
In #2 I think this is much of a muchness. Best practice user technique is different for a heavily backboned brush vs something much softer, so you'll find preferences either way. I do think a stiffer brush that provides more of a 'scrub' possibly gives a marginally more exfoliating effect than a softer one, I suspect the difference is far less than you'd expect from the brush firmness as the razor used after in both of them is the real remover of dead skin cells.

I find that in bowl lathering - which I predominately do - that the stiffer brushes take less work to build a comparable amount of lather. But I agree that technique is the main factor to a good lather.
Personally when face lathering the backbone adds to the scritchiness of the brush on the face. This can often be a disadvantage.

#3 I think lesser backboned brushes have big advantage in spreading and subsequent passes. Don't get me wrong I'm not talking about complete absence of backbone as @Pjotr alluded - but the ability to have them splay/bend to spread the existing lather within them is much easier than say with a very stiff Omega 48.

When I was trialing the Hoar the amount of backbone in the brush made spreading the lather more work. It had a tendency to spring back and flick lather around the bathroom. Also the lather seemed to pool around the handle of the brush rather than stay in the knot - but that could have been my lack of technique again.
 
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