Assess my current brush, maybe suggest a new one?

[Mong.]

G'day folks. I'm settling in to my shave routine pretty well, and I'm starting to pick up on some things that can potentially be improved. My current brush is one inherited from my dad, who inherited it from his dad. I'm not sure how old it is or what class it's in, but I suspect it's nothing more than entry level. The only text on it reads "Sterilised - Made in England" and the brand name, Culmak. Here's a few pics:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/7263/img1623jm.jpg

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/7236/img1620on.jpg

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/1734/img1619d.jpg

Sorry for the pic quality, my camera kinda sucks.

It's not synthetic as far as I can tell, the bristles feel soft on the outside but are scratchy on my face. It had fairly average care before it came to me I think, as there are a lot of broken bristles and the density is visibly patchy in the center. Denser around the edges, but it's a bit wild in some places around the edge. It does shed a bit, which is one reason I'm considering purchasing a new one. It's also housed in pretty average looking plastic. From the coloration in bristles that you can see in the first two photos and a brief look at Culmak's website, it seems like it might be low grade badger? A google search for older Culmak stuff hasn't yielded much, though they're obviously still going with entry level kit. I'll obviously keep this brush, but I'd like to relegate it to backup.

I'm very much into the notion of spending more in the first place to get something that will last and stay consistent in feel and performance. I'm also mindful that I don't have the knowledge to tell the difference between a mid range and high end brush now, so I'd like to find a happy medium. A few requirements and desirable features:

- <$60 is optimum, but I'll potentially factor in some of that to seek a cheapish Omega boar brush
- to be predominantly used with TOBS St Jermyn Shave Soap
- starting firm, and softening slightly
- black handle (with or without chrome)
- nothing too huge

Somewhere I can buy this with TOBS soap and perhaps a preshave oil would be appreciated, I'd like to get it all done in one order. I'm having a look at the Omega's and VieLong's recommended previously, as well as the Frank Shaving Silvertip (shaveshed) and Luxury Shaving Silvertip (shaving.ie). Not sure about the cheapy Omega's, are they all boar? I'm very interested to hear what you guys think, and before it's pointed out that I could get a passable result for cheap, I just won $500 on a scratchie so I'm seeing this as an opportunity to invest in my appearance for the future so my budget could stretch a little bit. Sorry for the wall of text!

 

[Monsta_AU]

My current brush is one inherited from my dad, who inherited it from his dad. I'm not sure how old it is or what class it's in, but I suspect it's nothing more than entry level. The only text on it reads "Sterilised - Made in England" and the brand name, Culmak.

Looks like it has had it's day. Hard to see in the photos but many of the hairs look like the ends have broken off, or maybe attacked by scissors??

That said I understand it has sentimental value, so it's good to keep. You may even decide to restore it by replacing the knot so it is 'like new' again.

I'm very much into the notion of spending more in the first place to get something that will last and stay consistent in feel and performance. I'm also mindful that I don't have the knowledge to tell the difference between a mid range and high end brush now, so I'd like to find a happy medium.

I think that everything I said about the VieLongs previously is still the most applicable. I would suggest something a bit scrubbier so horse really comes into it's own, just grab the 13710 like I did and go! The handle is not great (and mine has fallen off the sink a few times) but the MWF this morning certainly was feeling pain!

- <$60 is optimum, but I'll potentially factor in some of that to seek a cheapish Omega boar brush
- to be predominantly used with TOBS St Jermyn Shave Soap
- starting firm, and softening slightly
- black handle (with or without chrome)
- nothing too huge

• Any boar will soften more than horse. I've gone right off Semogues for this reason, although some stay firmer.
• With a soap you want to be able to get the product up into the knot. Scrubbier, firmer brushes are better for this.
• Black handle is harder with VieLong. I like the look of this one but it's like dark metal as it is termed 'lead finish'. 21mm knot with 50mm loft as per my 13710, but this can be modified as Gifts&Care offer a make-to-order service with VieLong. I think you would be fine with it as per the factory dimensions.
• Dimensionally it is a touch on the tall side but the horsehair is different to boar or badger - it has a springiness and backbone that the others don't so it needs to be a bit taller.. I enjoy mine, and I have a very bloomed Semogue 730HD Silvertip Badger.

Somewhere I can buy this with TOBS soap and perhaps a preshave oil would be appreciated, I'd like to get it all done in one order. I'm having a look at the Omega's and VieLong's recommended previously, as well as the Frank Shaving Silvertip (shaveshed) and Luxury Shaving Silvertip (shaving.ie). Not sure about the cheapy Omega's, are they all boar? I'm very interested to hear what you guys think, and before it's pointed out that I could get a passable result for cheap, I just won $500 on a scratchie so I'm seeing this as an opportunity to invest in my appearance for the future so my budget could stretch a little bit. Sorry for the wall of text!

G&C stock Jermyn St soap. Preshave oil is useless, it may help glide but it won't help the lather to penetrate the hair shaft to make it easier to cut. Better off with good preparation and working the lather into your face - so face lathering is ideal for that. The only issue with G&C is that once you get over a certain weight, postage gets expensive (more than 20g IIRC). You should be okay with 2 brushes and one soap.

Yes, cheap Omegas are all boar. But they are better than Semogue, cheaper too!

Since you are in Melbourne, I should say MensBiz but unfortunately his brushes are approaching triple the price for a brush that is not as good. The Men-U Bristle (Bristle = Boar if you didn't know) is $30 and you could get two better quality Omegas from overseas posted for that price.

Shaving.ie are good, if you went there I would say get the Semogue 620 and Omega 31064 Boars. $16 each, and to compare them would be interesting. Postage is best if you order late Thursday or Early Friday, at worst it is processed Friday and makes the Saturday Morning flight from Heathrow to Sydney. It's usually in my hands the following Friday.

The Frank Shaving / Luxury Shaving are floppy and no good for soaps. I would not bother unless heading for a shaving cream.

 

[lenard]

Your dads brush looks like a boar, I wish my dad had held on to his old shaving gear.

$60 isn't going to get you much in the way of badger, you might want to at a boar brush. Connaught sell the Omega brushes and they have Tobs and the shipping is reasonable.

 

[Drubbing]

More money doesn't buy better, just more luxury and pricey materials. High end Badger is just plain expensive, I found them to fat and floppy. Something like a Simpson Berkeley in a smaller brush, or Duke in a medium are good value, without going silly. I really do rate Simspon's Best hair.

It really depends what you like and you won't know til you try a good badger and boar. Yours is probably badger being sterilised - seems an English thing that they liked to print on brushes, hard to tell without feeling it. It's probably got too many broken hairs to be optimal or soft though. A reknot to make it useable is a great idea, I did that with my Dad's brush and PJ here did a great job fitting the pre bought knot. Best to know what you like first though.

PM your details and I'll send you a badger that will work well with soaps if you like.

Nothing wrong with a good omega boar either. Cheap enough to try a couple and I prefer them over badger most of the time.

 

[Johnus]

Agree with the above. Brushes are funny that way. There seems to be no set standard from company to company and money may buy you a better handle or a name but not knot quality. Best to follow suggestions on what others have found best. Good luck.

 

[mr626]

As per my other thread, I've ordered these two:

Vie-Long Horse Hair Shaving Brush 12601 - Gifts&Care
OMEGA 11137 Pure Bristle Shaving Brush

Happy to let you know my thoughts on them once I get them (but you might want to order something before then?)

I also have an embarrassing number of these on the way (horse hair):
Wooden Handled Shaving Brushes no:6 [brush6] - $2.45 : Bestshave.net, International supplier of shaving equipment
Although I've already given a few away, I actually haven't had the chance to use one yet. Crazily cheap and obviously not going to compare to the quality of the Vie Long ones, but it still gets great reviews. Might be a cheap way to try a horse hair?

When I first started, I was using this:
Semogue 1470 Shaving Brush

It has gone very floppy though- now the wife uses it to make a lather to shave her legs!

I also own one of these:
Luxury Shaving Ivory & Chrome Silvertip Brush
I find it to be very good, if a little large. It retains heaps of water too- going from the 1470 to it I had a few lathers that were way too wet, since the 1470 hardly retains any water compared to this beast.

 

[Mong.]

Firstly, thanks to all of you for your thoughts.

Looks like it has had it's day. Hard to see in the photos but many of the hairs look like the ends have broken off, or maybe attacked by scissors??

Yeah, there are a lot of broken bristles. Certainly no scissors from me, but it wouldn't surprise me if my cousin did something like that.

I like the look of this one but it's like dark metal as it is termed 'lead finish'.

I like the look of that, but I'm wondering about the difference in the knot compared to the 13710. The dimensions are the same and the appearance is similar. I was looking to keep my bathroom colors consistent, but paying double the price solely for appearance is silly so I'd rather go with the 13710 if they're the same. That'd also let me pick up the matching boar 13710C for the same price (more or less) as the metallic 13055.

Any idea how the 13710C stacks up to the Omega 31064?

More money doesn't buy better, just more luxury and pricey materials. It really depends what you like and you won't know til you try a good badger and boar.

Reasonable points as always, though I didn't realise the standards weren't consistent across brands. Thanks Johnus for pointing that out. I was hoping to skip a step or too and jump into a medium-high grade brush, but experimenting seems to be the way to go.

Yours is probably badger being sterilised - seems an English thing that they liked to print on brushes, hard to tell without feeling it. It's probably got too many broken hairs to be optimal or soft though. A reknot to make it useable is a great idea, I did that with my Dad's brush and PJ here did a great job fitting the pre bought knot. Best to know what you like first though.

It's definitely not soft, the bristles are quite scratchy and I do wonder if the lack of density is adversely affecting my lather. I'll definitely consider a reknot in the future, but I'm not sure the cheap plastic case is worth a big investment. I'll probably just keep it as an heirloom, I think.

PM your details and I'll send you a badger that will work well with soaps if you like.

This would be brilliant, thank you! It'll be a good chance to at least decide if badger is to my liking.

Happy to let you know my thoughts on them once I get them (but you might want to order something before then?)

That would be great, actually. I'm happy to wait to get a bit more information, and that will give me a chance to see about the badger too hopefully. I do have a no. 6 on the way too, but I've just planned to use it as my travel brush. It should be here soon too, so I'll be able to get a better idea.

I also own one of these:
Luxury Shaving Ivory & Chrome Silvertip Brush
I find it to be very good, if a little large. It retains heaps of water too- going from the 1470 to it I had a few lathers that were way too wet, since the 1470 hardly retains any water compared to this beast.

Any particular pros and cons of this that you've found? Sounds like it would be pretty good for creams, and not so much for soaps?

Thanks Lenard too for the Connaught link, I'll check it out as well. Cheers everyone for the info, I'll go do a bit more research now on these. I guess I really need to decide if I'm going with the St Jermyn soap or cream. That might be worthy of another thread, but in the interest of keeping it all together, does anyone have thoughts on that? I hate lathering in the tub, so I'd probably relocate both to a separate bowl before use. The soap is more expensive by a reasonable amount, but I expect I'd need to use less each time?

 

[mr626]

Luxury Shaving Ivory & Chrome Silvertip Brush: pros and cons (from my point of view, obviously).

Note: I've only ever used this with creams, so I can't comment on soaps.

Pros:
-Massive plume that (so far) has held its shape very well.
-Holds heaps of water
-Looks pretty nice I guess?

Cons:
-Almost too big, especially for someone like me (small face to start with, and I have a goatee so I don't have the 'surface area' that some guys would have)
-Quite heavy (compared to my 1470 boar anyway).
-Would prefer slightly firmer bristles (although it is pretty good- better than the 1470).

Overall it was a good purchase- I wanted to try a silver-tip and this was the cheapest way to do it.

 

[Monsta_AU]

I like the look of that, but I'm wondering about the difference in the knot compared to the 13710. The dimensions are the same and the appearance is similar. I was looking to keep my bathroom colors consistent, but paying double the price solely for appearance is silly so I'd rather go with the 13710 if they're the same. That'd also let me pick up the matching boar 13710C for the same price (more or less) as the metallic 13055.

I'd say there was possibly more mane (finer, softer) hair in it over the 13710. Most of the talk seems to be regarding the mix of mane hair versus tail hair. That said the 13710 is a $10 brush and the handle shows it, but the knot quality is great and I am sure you would love scrubbing a MWF puck with it like I do.

Any idea how the 13710C stacks up to the Omega 31064?

I only have one Omega, and it is the stupidly firm 10029 that I sourced from Jason (DrIdiot) over YKW - although he now has his own website. Prices are good, postage is reasonably quick as he is based in Singapore. He also stocks Simpsons brushes, dunno if the prices are good. Lots of lower end razors - got the last of his Feather portables (Gillette Travelling Tech clone)> I consider him a trusted seller.

Thanks Lenard too for the Connaught link, I'll check it out as well. Cheers everyone for the info, I'll go do a bit more research now on these. I guess I really need to decide if I'm going with the St Jermyn soap or cream. That might be worthy of another thread, but in the interest of keeping it all together, does anyone have thoughts on that? I hate lathering in the tub, so I'd probably relocate both to a separate bowl before use. The soap is more expensive by a reasonable amount, but I expect I'd need to use less each time?

My last tub of Jermyn St (Connaught-sourced) is so thick it is almost Croap, it really isn't far off Tipo Morbido texture. The soap will probably last longer, the cream will be more user friendly. I have mentioned it previously, but Jermyn cream lathers like a rabid dog at noon on a midsummer's day. You seriously can't go wrong.

 

[Mong.]

Alrighty, I'm gunna take a few days and trawl through the internet for every possible thought on these brushes, I'm a stickler for research. In the meantime, Drubbing has very kindly said he'd send me the Blobby Foo so that I can try out a badger and hopefully this'll let me discover whether or not it's worth looking at the Frank Shaving brushes. Hopefully my bestshave no.6 isn't too far away so I can try a horsey too.

Thanks for your thoughts gents, very much appreciated.

 

[Mong.]

A quick update for you folks. The Blobby arrived, and it's been bloody educational. If I can take it as being pretty typical of what badger feels like, there's just no comparison between this and my old one which makes me wonder if the Culmak is actually boar. Aesthetic and comfort commentary aside, I've now realised that my lather was bollocks. I was feeling pretty competent about it, but the comparison after receiving the Blobby is like running out on the MCG on the weekend to play footy, instead of the local club. Now that I've actually seen what a yoghurty consistency is like with my own eyes, what I used to create can only be described as poor.

I'm quite keen waiting for my shave bowl from bestshave.net to arrive, because I'm gunna need to practice whipping up a reasonable lather again. This new brush holds a lot more water than my old one, and adjusting to that during my last shave was pretty tough. I completely ruined my first lather because I didn't realise how much water it retained, so I wound up with a soppy useless mess. The second one was better, but it's gunna take some practice. I'll whip up a few practice bowls before I have another shave, I think it'll make a big difference to my comfort.

I'm really happy I looked into brushes now instead of just persisting with the old one, because my latest successful shave (no irritation except for a few existing spots) can be attributed to either the improved lather made by the Blobby or the Rapira blade which I tried for the first time. I'm thinking that it's a happy medium of both, but regardless, thanks very much to Drubbing for sending this along! It's one thing to think you understand a concept or skill, but seeing it in front of you is the way to learn and your generosity has enabled that for me. Cheers mate.

One last note. I can't help myself, so once I run out of Proraso, I might pick up a cheap boar and horsie for comparison from Connaught, seeing as I've more or less settled on the TOBS St Jermyn as my next venture into soap/cream (haven't decided yet) and their prices are pretty reasonable. I figure I can alternate between TOBS and boar/horse, and Proraso Red/Green and the Blobby over summer. Hopefully that'll be a fairly reliable combo to help me roll through my list of blades to try while I search for my go-to blade.

 

[JugV2]

Jermyn is the bomb. It's my hands down favourite cream ever. The scent is great and the lather is typical of TOBS.

2

 

[Drubbing]

A quick update for you folks. The Blobby arrived, and it's been bloody educational. If I can take it as being pretty typical of what badger feels like, there's just no comparison between this and my old one which makes me wonder if the Culmak is actually boar. Aesthetic and comfort commentary aside, I've now realised that my lather was bollocks. I was feeling pretty competent about it, but the comparison after receiving the Blobby is like running out on the MCG on the weekend to play footy, instead of the local club. Now that I've actually seen what a yoghurty consistency is like with my own eyes, what I used to create can only be described as poor.

That's great to hear. The Blobby has a TGN knot in it, and they are really good knots - just too sparse and soft for me. But they do make lather really easy, the lack of density allows soap, air and water to mix really easily and quickly. If I made crap lather, I'd still give myself a crap shave - it's an essential skill.

It's pretty easy to get to grips with making lather - soak the brush a bit, squeeze it, dab some cream on and dip in water as you work up a lather. Trying to get the right amount of both at the start is a waste of time.

Some here still like the Semogues if you're looking at boars - the handles are nice, but I think Omegas are superior, and cheaper.

 

[Nick the Knife]

Some here still like the Semogues if you're looking at boars - the handles are nice, but I think Omegas are superior, and cheaper.

Thats interesting as I've formed the perception that the Semogues, particularly the mid-upper level ones would be vastly superior to even the best of the Omegas.....yet if you say this I definitely listen as from what I've read you really know your boar brushes.

I think we have similar tastes in brushes too from what I've read - I like a fair bit of backbone and a decent scratch from the brush itself, anything thats too soft or floppy whilst it might get a great lather going just doesn't cut the mustard. One little gem I found was a little known Turkish brand (so alas hard to find) but its the Jaguar 117/24 'Professional'. I had it recommended to me as the personal brush of choice by the previously well known Turkish seller, Ferroburak.

FWIW whats the BEST boar brush you've used and also the best value boar brush you've used?

Have you tried many of the horse hair brushes? I've not tried any of the better ones (Vie Long etc) but just the #6 Bestshave....which is so-so, a good rotation brush or one for the missus to use.

 

[Drubbing]

I found Smogs pricing was probably more related to handle handle cost than anything else. They make a big deal out of the hair grade thing, but to me, they all felt the same - just either longer or fatter. The bigger they got, the floppier they were. I had too many finicky moments with Smogs too, sometimes the bastards just refused to make lather worth using after 1 pass, despite copious loading. I mean terrible watery stuff, not being a lather snob or anything. I grew tired of sadsters YKW making out I was some sort of retard for not making them work consistently. I like to think it was the brushes - given every other one I have performed as advertised.

The best boar I have is probably the best value - Omega 10005. About $10. They sell the same knot in a couple of different handles I think. I got a few more just to have something bigger and smaller than the 05. They're all good.

 

[Nick the Knife]

The best boar I have is probably the best value - Omega 10005. About $10. They sell the same knot in a couple of different handles I think. I got a few more just to have something bigger and smaller than the 05. They're all good.

Ah much thanks for your reply and info, very interesting and appreciate your thoughts.

The ONLY Omega brush I have is..........the 10005! So suffice to say I'm very happy to hear your endorsement of it. I have to say I concur, couldn't say anything bad about it at all. Have had it a few years after picking one up from a small country town barber as it was all he was selling and it was my first proper brush. Thanks for the feedback and thoughts.

 

[Pjotr]

Unlike badger brushes, where there is a distinct difference in hair characteristics depending on which part of the animal the bristle it was situated, a boar brush is a boar brush is a boar brush. Semoque, in the full knowledge of this, attempt to make their boar brushes different through setting an 18mm knot in a flaired cup to produce what is advertised as a 22mm knot. As a result you end up almost without fail with a brush which may feel softer but is basically gutless and becomes more gutless with time as the bristles soften up. Just look at their website and you see brushes that flair out like a badger on steroids. I've stripped a few, including what is now the Blobby Foo, and wouldn't buy a Semogue in a fit. If it's boar brush you want, get an Omega. For a badger you can't go wrong with any Simpson with a best badger knot.

 

[Drubbing]

Yes, Nick probably missed the worldwide expose of Smogs construction. But it happened here first.

I was surprised to find out they trick-up the density, but it did answers as to why they are never as firm as other boars.

 

[Monsta_AU]

If you want a scrubbly brush with good backbone yet softness, I think the cheap VieLong Horsey brushes are far superior to the best of the Omega Boars. Maybe I need to send mine to Drubbing so he may be enlightened.

 

[Drubbing]

The Vintage razor enlightened me - that modern ones are better.

Didn't get a chance to trial your mystery blades...